NOTICE : This RFC page replaces RFC#1 Rationale for a second RFC round:
SummaryVersion 1 of STC was developed in 2007, prior to the development and adoption of vo-dml modeling practices. As we progress to the development of vo-dml compliant component models, it is necessary to revisit those models which define core content. Additionally, the scope of the STC-1.0 model is very broad, making a complete implementation and development of validators, very difficult. As such it may be prudent to break the content of STC-1.0 into component models itself, which as a group, cover the scope of the original. This effort will start from first principles with respect to defining a specific project use-case, from which requirements will be drawn, satisfied by the model, and implemented in the use-case. We will make use of the original model to ensure that the coverage of concepts is complete and that the models will be compatible. However, the form and structure may be quite different. This model will use vo-dml modeling practices, and model elements may be structured differently to more efficiently represent the concepts. This model covers the description of measured or determined astronomical data, and includes the following concepts:
Implementation Requirements(from DM Working group twiki): The "IVOA Document Standards" standard has a broad outline of the implementation requirements for IVOA standards. These requirements fit best into the higher level standards for applications and protocols than for data models themselves. At the Oct 2017 interop in Trieste, the following implementation requirements for Data Model Standards was agreed upon, which allow the models to be vetted against their requirements and use cases, without needing full science use cases to be implemented.
Serializations:
Software:A detailed study was performed to determine the compatibility of the Meas/Coords data models to the AstroPy package, a popular Python package with intensive support for Space and Time coordinates.
ValidatorsAs noted above, the serializations may be validated to various degrees using the corresponding schema
UsageIn the period since the close of the RFC2 review, a great deal of effort has been made to illustrate the usability of the Meas/Coords models in the context of real world scenarios. Each have confirmed the usability of the data models, and illustrate how annotating data to models can facilitate interoperability. These include:
Links with CoordsThe Measurement model is heavily dependent on the Coordinates model (also in RFC) for its core elements. Information about its relation to the Coordinates model, and how the requirements are distributed can be found on the STC2 page Comments from the IVOA Community during RFC/TCG review period: 2020-10-26 - 2020-12-07
Comments by Markus DemleitnerThe introduction and points (1), (4), (7), (11) from my RFC 1 comments I'd still retain, and I essentially stand by the summary, which I'd update to: I'd make the model a lot smaller, thus creating space we'll need once we tackle strict errors (i.e., explicit distributions) in earnest one day. We ought to have, perhaps NaiveMeasuremetnt (a pseudo-distribution saying "value is something like an expectation or perhaps a median, and error is something like a first moment or something like that), and perhaps AsymmetricNaiveMeasure. I'm not even convinced we have credible use cases for statError and sysError. And if we want correlations, these should be explicit as relations between, I guess, measurements (or their parameters?).
Comments from TCG member during the RFC/TCG Review Period: 2022-02-24 - 2022-04-10WG chairs or vice chairs must read the Document, provide comments if any (including on topics not directly linked to the Group matters) or indicate that they have no comment. IG chairs or vice chairs are also encouraged to do the same, althought their inputs are not compulsory.
TCG Chair & Vice Chair
Applications Working Group
Data Access Layer Working Group
Data Model Working Group
Grid & Web Services Working Group
Registry Working Group
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< < | By reading the proposed recommendation I (Carlo writing) am not sure about the scope of the document. Does it concern only astro-objects (galaxies, planets, stars) or also phenomenon? It is not clearly stated. | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
> > | By reading the proposed recommendation I (Carlo writing) am not sure about the scope of the document. Does it concern only astro-objects (galaxies, planets, stars) or also phenomenon? It is not clearly stated. | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
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< < | For example: may I use this DM to describe a set of measurements made in the case of a laboratory astrophysics experience? In this case all the coordinates part is useless and I will need something to describe the experimental set (conditions, instruments). This part is missing. | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
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> > | The Measurement model is a very generic base model, and may be used wherever the concepts apply. In 'Context and Scope':
-- MarkCresitelloDittmar - 2022-05-18 For example: may I use this DM to describe a set of measurements made in the case of a laboratory astrophysics experience? In this case all the coordinates part is useless and I will need something to describe the experimental set (conditions, instruments). This part is missing. Response: I'm not sure I understand the case. The model should be valid for describing simulated results, since the model describes only the 'result' (ie: the measured/determined value), and not how it was obtained (conditions, instruments, settings). That information would be stored in the Observation/Dataset metadata and/or with Provenance -- MarkCresitelloDittmar - 2022-05-18 | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Also if I assume that this DM is proposed only for phenomena observed up in the sky, how can we deal with measured spectral line (we have the case in the ongoing LineTAP working draft): we don’t care very much about the coordinates of the measured line, but we need to know the energy states and the emitting element. We cannot describe this measurement with this proposed DM model. | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
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> > | Response:
We do not expect this model to serve all possible cases, it is a Version 1. For example, the DM workshop had cases where MANGO is looking into how to support Quality flags. The error model is one area where we expect a lot of growth in the future as we support more complex cases. If LineTAP has a case which 'should' be supported by this model, we can take it as a project to fold into an update -- MarkCresitelloDittmar - 2022-05-18 | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Could you please explain what is the scope and the validity/limitation domain for this recoomandation? What is this for? | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
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< < | Data Curation & Preservation Interest Group | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
> > | Data Curation & Preservation Interest Group | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Education Interest Group
Knowledge Discovery Interest Group
Radioastronomy Interest Group
Solar System Interest GroupPoints of confusion for me:
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> > |
Response:
Exactly. The pixel domain describes the image cells (which are outside of the Measurement scope, and handled by the Coordinates model). The image cell VALUE however, is within the Measurement scope. -- MarkCresitelloDittmar - 2022-05-18 | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
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> > | Response:
I think this may be more clear after reading the document.
It simply means that a 1-dimensional measure are expected to have a 1D error (eg Symmetrical, Bounds1D).. not a 2D (Ellipse) or 3D (Ellipsoid). -- MarkCresitelloDittmar - 2022-05-18 | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Typos:
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> > | Response: Corrected..
-- MarkCresitelloDittmar - 2022-05-18 | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
-- AnneRaugh - 2022-04-20
Theory Interest Group
Time Domain Interest Group
Operations
Standards and Processes Committee
TCG Vote : Vote_start_date - Vote_end_dateIf you have minor comments (typos) on the last version of the document please indicate it in the Comments column of the table and post them in the TCG comments section above with the date.
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